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	<title>Comments on: More Fallout From Controversial Referee Call in US vs Canada Olympic Women&#8217;s Soccer Semifinal</title>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-30136</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Aug 2012 01:09:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-30136</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[yankiboy
 August 9, 2012 

How about the trick with some fish line tied to a dollar bill, chasing it down the sidewalk.  Now that&#039;s a side splitter. eh.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yankiboy<br />
 August 9, 2012 </p>
<p>How about the trick with some fish line tied to a dollar bill, chasing it down the sidewalk.  Now that&#8217;s a side splitter. eh.</p>
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		<title>By: The Choosen One</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-30021</link>
		<dc:creator>The Choosen One</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Aug 2012 23:14:25 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[Brian

Do you follow any other sports in the Twin Cities? There is a reason women&#039;s basketball got more coverage by the local media. The women&#039;s basketball has more ties to Minnesota than the women&#039;s soccer team. Maya Moore, Seimone  	Augustu and of course the darling of women&#039;s basketball in the state of Minnesota Lindsay Whalen. All three play for the defending WNBA champions Minnesota Lynx.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brian</p>
<p>Do you follow any other sports in the Twin Cities? There is a reason women&#8217;s basketball got more coverage by the local media. The women&#8217;s basketball has more ties to Minnesota than the women&#8217;s soccer team. Maya Moore, Seimone  	Augustu and of course the darling of women&#8217;s basketball in the state of Minnesota Lindsay Whalen. All three play for the defending WNBA champions Minnesota Lynx.</p>
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		<title>By: peter</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29911</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2012 20:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29911</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Keith,

When I ref a game and a player keeps counting or trying to tell me how to ref the game I’ll give the player a warning.  If the player doesn&#039;t stop I&#039;ll show the player a yellow card.
Please also note the following about the rule book, if a player gets injured during a match most likely the opposing team will kick the ball out so they can attend to the injured player.  This is a good sportsmanship and you won’t see that in the rule book.  Just like in a tennis match if a player misses his or her first server the opponent doesn’t smash the ball back at him (tennis code of ethics).  This is also not in tennis rule book.
In addition we always encourage referees to use their discretion in making any call, based on the factors that went into making the decision in the first place.   You have to make the decision and stick with it.    If the keeper keeps the ball too long I’ll give ONE verbal warning and the next time will be an indirect kick.   The ref determines what is acceptable and what is not. You also want the game to flow, there is lots of pushing and shaving in soccer if you go by the rule book you&#039;ll have to interrupt the game constantly.   
This game shouldn’t have been decided by penalty kick, the idea of the player jump too high or turned or moved her arm up or down is irrelevant.   Because it all comes down to “discretion” and the reason is it wasn’t clear if the ball was touched on purpose or not.  If you look at any legit sport website or news cast no one can say for sure if it was a penalty.   You want the opposing team to earn it.  In addition if the center ref isn’t sure of a particular call they can always consult the linesmen (referee helper).  Part of the linesman job is to raise his flag if there was a foul in the box.  I think the linesman wasn’t that great either he should of pointed to plenty area if he also thought it was a penalty.  In addition few minutes after the game was tied up the ball was touched by US defender and it clearly crossed the end line which would have given a corner kick to Canada.  But the linesman gave a goal kick. May be his view was blocked.  The point is referees will miss some calls and that is just the nature of the game.  However giving a penalty kick or awarding indirect kick because keeper kept the ball too long at the end of the game is simply should not happen at this level.   Clear US didn’t earn this win.  

Peter]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Keith,</p>
<p>When I ref a game and a player keeps counting or trying to tell me how to ref the game I’ll give the player a warning.  If the player doesn&#8217;t stop I&#8217;ll show the player a yellow card.<br />
Please also note the following about the rule book, if a player gets injured during a match most likely the opposing team will kick the ball out so they can attend to the injured player.  This is a good sportsmanship and you won’t see that in the rule book.  Just like in a tennis match if a player misses his or her first server the opponent doesn’t smash the ball back at him (tennis code of ethics).  This is also not in tennis rule book.<br />
In addition we always encourage referees to use their discretion in making any call, based on the factors that went into making the decision in the first place.   You have to make the decision and stick with it.    If the keeper keeps the ball too long I’ll give ONE verbal warning and the next time will be an indirect kick.   The ref determines what is acceptable and what is not. You also want the game to flow, there is lots of pushing and shaving in soccer if you go by the rule book you&#8217;ll have to interrupt the game constantly.<br />
This game shouldn’t have been decided by penalty kick, the idea of the player jump too high or turned or moved her arm up or down is irrelevant.   Because it all comes down to “discretion” and the reason is it wasn’t clear if the ball was touched on purpose or not.  If you look at any legit sport website or news cast no one can say for sure if it was a penalty.   You want the opposing team to earn it.  In addition if the center ref isn’t sure of a particular call they can always consult the linesmen (referee helper).  Part of the linesman job is to raise his flag if there was a foul in the box.  I think the linesman wasn’t that great either he should of pointed to plenty area if he also thought it was a penalty.  In addition few minutes after the game was tied up the ball was touched by US defender and it clearly crossed the end line which would have given a corner kick to Canada.  But the linesman gave a goal kick. May be his view was blocked.  The point is referees will miss some calls and that is just the nature of the game.  However giving a penalty kick or awarding indirect kick because keeper kept the ball too long at the end of the game is simply should not happen at this level.   Clear US didn’t earn this win.  </p>
<p>Peter</p>
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		<title>By: keith</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29865</link>
		<dc:creator>keith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2012 06:14:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29865</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Richard, I don&#039;t know where you are from or anything about you except you know little about soccer and are typical of the &quot;fans&quot; I see on websites all over the world. The Canadian keeper routinely held the ball for over 10 seconds. Videos show her holding the ball over 15 seconds twice. These are offenses. These are illegal. Abby Wambach was counting seconds out loud. I must have missed where in the Laws this is forbidden and if you have a copy, no, it doesn&#039;t constitute unsporting behavior if you wanted to  go there.

WHO was cheating? The Canadian keeper who routinely was breaking the Laws or an American player simply pointing this out? I think even you can answer that. And, oh yeah, we have that small matter of a Canadian player stomping an American player&#039;s head. And you have the gall to say the USA is more interested in winning by cheating than Fair Play? Amazingly stupid, but fully expected remark from someone that knows nothing about soccer other than, apparently, he can&#039;t stand the USA.

As to your ranting about the Japan game; doesn&#039;t really deserve any comment.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard, I don&#8217;t know where you are from or anything about you except you know little about soccer and are typical of the &#8220;fans&#8221; I see on websites all over the world. The Canadian keeper routinely held the ball for over 10 seconds. Videos show her holding the ball over 15 seconds twice. These are offenses. These are illegal. Abby Wambach was counting seconds out loud. I must have missed where in the Laws this is forbidden and if you have a copy, no, it doesn&#8217;t constitute unsporting behavior if you wanted to  go there.</p>
<p>WHO was cheating? The Canadian keeper who routinely was breaking the Laws or an American player simply pointing this out? I think even you can answer that. And, oh yeah, we have that small matter of a Canadian player stomping an American player&#8217;s head. And you have the gall to say the USA is more interested in winning by cheating than Fair Play? Amazingly stupid, but fully expected remark from someone that knows nothing about soccer other than, apparently, he can&#8217;t stand the USA.</p>
<p>As to your ranting about the Japan game; doesn&#8217;t really deserve any comment.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: keith</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29864</link>
		<dc:creator>keith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2012 06:00:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29864</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[tomAss: no. The offense is deliberately handling the ball. The word &quot;intentional&quot; is almost never used by soccer referees anywhere (yes, I am one) as that indicates one knows what the player was thinking. Advice To Referees is a USSF publication to help us. USSF puts out memoranda from time to time also and I&#039;m going to paste one here they put out on &quot;Handling Offenses&quot; because it discusses something that you never see anywhere in the media and has led to a huge amount of confusion in the general public: avoidability. When deciding whether or not a deliberate handling offense has occurred, the referee has to decide could the contact of the hand (or arm) with the ball been avoided. If the exact same thing had happened in a U16 girls game, there would have been no call if the referee knew what she was doing because at that level of play we don&#039;t expect a player to have the skills to avoid the ball and throwing your arm up would be expected. The players in this game are the best in the world. Here&#039;s the paste:

Recent incidents in the professional leagues involving possible handling
offenses have caused considerable comment and debate. For those not
officiating the match, multiple camera angles, instant replay, and slow-motion
viewing make the debate easier because they allow a leisurely analysis of the
facts well after the relevant decision has to be made.
The Laws of the Game declare that a direct free kick is given to the
opposing team if a player “handles the ball deliberately (except for the
goalkeeper within his own penalty area).” This simple statement defines one of
the ten listed offenses in the first part of Law 12 (Fouls and Misconduct) and lies
at the historical and traditional heart of soccer, a game played with all parts of the
body other than the hands. Only the goalkeeper is exempt from this restriction
and only while within his own penalty area.
What are the characteristics of a clear handling offense?
• A player deliberately carries, strikes, or propels the ball with the
hand or arm
• It is the player’s action that initiates the contact with the ball
What characteristics of ball contact are clearly not handling offenses?
• The ball strikes the hand or arm (i.e., the ball initiates the contact)
• The contact is accidental (not the result of action by the player)
• The contact is the result of a purely reflexive effort at self-protection
What are the standards of judgment which the referee will apply when the
handling offense is not immediately clear?
• The distance or time within which the player had to react to avoid
contact – if there was time to avoid the contact, the likelihood of an
offense is greater
• The position of the player’s hand or arm at the time of the contact –
if the hand or arm is carried in an unnatural or unusual position
(e.g., high up in the air or, while defending against a free kick, far
away from the body), the likelihood of an offense is greater

Look at the last bullet point. This was at a free kick and the arm was high up in the air and in some of the  replays you see the arm also was extended from the body. Yes, the player did turn her head away which is something we look at but at this level of play, the arm has to stay down. The referee was in perfect position to make a call she knew she would take heat for but it IS the correct call and this referee showed a remarkable amount of guts to make it.

If there was one call or no call that was blatantly wrong in this game it was the one where a Canadian player stomped on a USA&#039;s player&#039;s head. Watching the replay you can see the referee was watching the ball and never saw this happen. Neither did the Assistant Referee. Had either seen this, Canada would have been playing a man short the rest of the game as it was an easy straight red card call that every referee would make. You can argue against the six second call (although it also was correct in Law) and the handball in the penalty area but no one can argue that the head stomp was legal.

Soccer is an interesting game and calls tend to even out at  the end of the match. No one &quot;took&quot; this game from Canada who played a splendid game. The referee missed a clear red card call. Just for the sake of argument, what if she had seen that but didn&#039;t make the six second call? Sure, you subtract the goal for the subsequent PK but what would the effect of Canada playing without one of it&#039;s best players for half the game had been? AND playing 10 against 11? Who knows and that&#039;s my point. This was an excellent game and the referee did an excellent job. She was rarely out of position and was able to keep pace with some of the finest athletes on this planet. She obviously knows The Laws Of The Game and she applied them as she saw fit for this particular game. One can&#039;t ask for more from any referee.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tomAss: no. The offense is deliberately handling the ball. The word &#8220;intentional&#8221; is almost never used by soccer referees anywhere (yes, I am one) as that indicates one knows what the player was thinking. Advice To Referees is a USSF publication to help us. USSF puts out memoranda from time to time also and I&#8217;m going to paste one here they put out on &#8220;Handling Offenses&#8221; because it discusses something that you never see anywhere in the media and has led to a huge amount of confusion in the general public: avoidability. When deciding whether or not a deliberate handling offense has occurred, the referee has to decide could the contact of the hand (or arm) with the ball been avoided. If the exact same thing had happened in a U16 girls game, there would have been no call if the referee knew what she was doing because at that level of play we don&#8217;t expect a player to have the skills to avoid the ball and throwing your arm up would be expected. The players in this game are the best in the world. Here&#8217;s the paste:</p>
<p>Recent incidents in the professional leagues involving possible handling<br />
offenses have caused considerable comment and debate. For those not<br />
officiating the match, multiple camera angles, instant replay, and slow-motion<br />
viewing make the debate easier because they allow a leisurely analysis of the<br />
facts well after the relevant decision has to be made.<br />
The Laws of the Game declare that a direct free kick is given to the<br />
opposing team if a player “handles the ball deliberately (except for the<br />
goalkeeper within his own penalty area).” This simple statement defines one of<br />
the ten listed offenses in the first part of Law 12 (Fouls and Misconduct) and lies<br />
at the historical and traditional heart of soccer, a game played with all parts of the<br />
body other than the hands. Only the goalkeeper is exempt from this restriction<br />
and only while within his own penalty area.<br />
What are the characteristics of a clear handling offense?<br />
• A player deliberately carries, strikes, or propels the ball with the<br />
hand or arm<br />
• It is the player’s action that initiates the contact with the ball<br />
What characteristics of ball contact are clearly not handling offenses?<br />
• The ball strikes the hand or arm (i.e., the ball initiates the contact)<br />
• The contact is accidental (not the result of action by the player)<br />
• The contact is the result of a purely reflexive effort at self-protection<br />
What are the standards of judgment which the referee will apply when the<br />
handling offense is not immediately clear?<br />
• The distance or time within which the player had to react to avoid<br />
contact – if there was time to avoid the contact, the likelihood of an<br />
offense is greater<br />
• The position of the player’s hand or arm at the time of the contact –<br />
if the hand or arm is carried in an unnatural or unusual position<br />
(e.g., high up in the air or, while defending against a free kick, far<br />
away from the body), the likelihood of an offense is greater</p>
<p>Look at the last bullet point. This was at a free kick and the arm was high up in the air and in some of the  replays you see the arm also was extended from the body. Yes, the player did turn her head away which is something we look at but at this level of play, the arm has to stay down. The referee was in perfect position to make a call she knew she would take heat for but it IS the correct call and this referee showed a remarkable amount of guts to make it.</p>
<p>If there was one call or no call that was blatantly wrong in this game it was the one where a Canadian player stomped on a USA&#8217;s player&#8217;s head. Watching the replay you can see the referee was watching the ball and never saw this happen. Neither did the Assistant Referee. Had either seen this, Canada would have been playing a man short the rest of the game as it was an easy straight red card call that every referee would make. You can argue against the six second call (although it also was correct in Law) and the handball in the penalty area but no one can argue that the head stomp was legal.</p>
<p>Soccer is an interesting game and calls tend to even out at  the end of the match. No one &#8220;took&#8221; this game from Canada who played a splendid game. The referee missed a clear red card call. Just for the sake of argument, what if she had seen that but didn&#8217;t make the six second call? Sure, you subtract the goal for the subsequent PK but what would the effect of Canada playing without one of it&#8217;s best players for half the game had been? AND playing 10 against 11? Who knows and that&#8217;s my point. This was an excellent game and the referee did an excellent job. She was rarely out of position and was able to keep pace with some of the finest athletes on this planet. She obviously knows The Laws Of The Game and she applied them as she saw fit for this particular game. One can&#8217;t ask for more from any referee.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29860</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2012 04:58:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29860</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Both Canada and the Japan team should protest these outrageous calls.  At least in Canada&#039;s case, there is no doubt that the Canadian player&#039;s arm did touch the ball, although it shouldn&#039;t have resulted in a penalty kick.  Abby Wambach&#039;s pressure she was applying to the referee all game long, to which she had admitted, had its intended effect eventually.

In Japan&#039;s case, they should protest the two critical bad calls which should have resulted in TWO PENALTY KICKS.  Why is it that the US team always benefits from the officiating?  Even the NBC announcers were incredulous at the officiating today.  Two penalty kicks would likely have put Japan on top of the podium today.  In typical Japanese fashion, they don&#039;t want to go there.  They just put up with this.  At least the Canadians had the guts to let the world know when they&#039;ve been wronged. 

I knew Japan was in trouble the minute I saw the four referees at the beginning of the game.  They are the same four that officiated last year&#039;s World Cup final, during which Ohno was called offsides in a 1 on 1 situation which would have resulted in a goal.  Even at that time, the announcers showed the replay and said it was a huge break for the US.  

I am really disappointed that the US players and Pia Sundhage doesn&#039;t acknowledge that they benefited immensely from the officiating.  It&#039;s as if winning, even by cheating, is more important than fair play.  Congratulations, Team USA, you can clutch your gold medals and sleep at night, especially Abby Wambach, even if your medals look a little bronze.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Both Canada and the Japan team should protest these outrageous calls.  At least in Canada&#8217;s case, there is no doubt that the Canadian player&#8217;s arm did touch the ball, although it shouldn&#8217;t have resulted in a penalty kick.  Abby Wambach&#8217;s pressure she was applying to the referee all game long, to which she had admitted, had its intended effect eventually.</p>
<p>In Japan&#8217;s case, they should protest the two critical bad calls which should have resulted in TWO PENALTY KICKS.  Why is it that the US team always benefits from the officiating?  Even the NBC announcers were incredulous at the officiating today.  Two penalty kicks would likely have put Japan on top of the podium today.  In typical Japanese fashion, they don&#8217;t want to go there.  They just put up with this.  At least the Canadians had the guts to let the world know when they&#8217;ve been wronged. </p>
<p>I knew Japan was in trouble the minute I saw the four referees at the beginning of the game.  They are the same four that officiated last year&#8217;s World Cup final, during which Ohno was called offsides in a 1 on 1 situation which would have resulted in a goal.  Even at that time, the announcers showed the replay and said it was a huge break for the US.  </p>
<p>I am really disappointed that the US players and Pia Sundhage doesn&#8217;t acknowledge that they benefited immensely from the officiating.  It&#8217;s as if winning, even by cheating, is more important than fair play.  Congratulations, Team USA, you can clutch your gold medals and sleep at night, especially Abby Wambach, even if your medals look a little bronze.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: tomASS</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29818</link>
		<dc:creator>tomASS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Aug 2012 20:49:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29818</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@Flipper - not you. Very poorly organized team defending play, appearances of lousy communication, and some very questionable individual defending tactics, all that said some very excellent attacking play by the Japanese to cause some of these problems.

Soccer Gods smiling on the US today]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Flipper &#8211; not you. Very poorly organized team defending play, appearances of lousy communication, and some very questionable individual defending tactics, all that said some very excellent attacking play by the Japanese to cause some of these problems.</p>
<p>Soccer Gods smiling on the US today</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
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		<title>By: Flipper</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29815</link>
		<dc:creator>Flipper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Aug 2012 20:18:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29815</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Is it me or are our (US) defenders simply horrible?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is it me or are our (US) defenders simply horrible?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: tomASS</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29809</link>
		<dc:creator>tomASS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Aug 2012 17:23:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29809</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@ Eric - probably splitting hairs but I believe the wording is &quot;intentional&quot; in the laws of the game. No worries, however in &quot;advice to referees&quot; that help in the interpretation of the laws; the question arises that  if you intentionally turn your body away is it a natural body motion of not getting hit in the face or was there intent to reach out and block the shot. It was solely Pedersen&#039;s call and interpretation of the set of actions that occurred.  It provides great banter for us, but it really does not matter what we think

leper - nice post]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Eric &#8211; probably splitting hairs but I believe the wording is &#8220;intentional&#8221; in the laws of the game. No worries, however in &#8220;advice to referees&#8221; that help in the interpretation of the laws; the question arises that  if you intentionally turn your body away is it a natural body motion of not getting hit in the face or was there intent to reach out and block the shot. It was solely Pedersen&#8217;s call and interpretation of the set of actions that occurred.  It provides great banter for us, but it really does not matter what we think</p>
<p>leper &#8211; nice post</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: leper</title>
		<link>http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2012/08/08/xx-2/#comment-29808</link>
		<dc:creator>leper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Aug 2012 17:03:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?p=35535#comment-29808</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sinclair&#039;s play in the tournament was outstanding.  Her post match comments not so much.  No one cheated Canada out of anything.  They had a bad (although completely correct within the laws of the game) call go against them.  Bad calls happen in soccer all the time.  The referee didn&#039;t cause them to block a shot with their hands.  Or to stop defending in the 120th minute and leave a player free for a header.  Or to classlessly stomp on an opponent&#039;s head.

I&#039;m surprised Sinclair wasn&#039;t suspended for the bronze medal match to be honest.  Saying that the referee deliberately threw the game or favored the other team (as opposed to just saying she made a bad call and cost you the game) calls into question the integrity of the entire competition.  You really shouldn&#039;t be able to get away with doing that without facing some kind of repercussions.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sinclair&#8217;s play in the tournament was outstanding.  Her post match comments not so much.  No one cheated Canada out of anything.  They had a bad (although completely correct within the laws of the game) call go against them.  Bad calls happen in soccer all the time.  The referee didn&#8217;t cause them to block a shot with their hands.  Or to stop defending in the 120th minute and leave a player free for a header.  Or to classlessly stomp on an opponent&#8217;s head.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m surprised Sinclair wasn&#8217;t suspended for the bronze medal match to be honest.  Saying that the referee deliberately threw the game or favored the other team (as opposed to just saying she made a bad call and cost you the game) calls into question the integrity of the entire competition.  You really shouldn&#8217;t be able to get away with doing that without facing some kind of repercussions.</p>
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